No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp

After a stellar performance on No Small Endeavor Live, 9 time Grammy Winner Sheryl Crow sits down with Lee to discuss the tension between ambition and creativity, the profound realization that accompanied her breast cancer diagnosis, and the impact of mindfulness and meditation on her daily life. Crow also tells the story behind her posthumous duet with Johnny Cash, the social advocacy that has defined her career, and how embracing an unconventional life led her to motherhood. All that, plus Sheryl's musical performance at No Small Endeavor: Live! Join us as we explore the challenges and triumphs of over 3 decades in the public eye. Show Notes Resources: The Sheryl Documentary "Forever" "Weather Channel" "Redemption Day" "Love Is A Good Thing" Sharon Salzberg & Faith Similar Episodes: Russ Taff: Music, Addiction and Redemption Amy Grant: Fame, Vulnerability, and Staying Grounded Tara Brach: Radical Acceptance Transcription Link Want more NSE? Join NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and early access to tickets to our live shows. Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and … Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Mike Cosper. How do you raise criticisms about a group of which you consider yourself to be a member? Mike Cosper hosted The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill, a podcast critiquing a lot of the tendencies of American Christianity. “ People are looking at Christianity and saying, is it true?” he says. “I think where I landed after my own negative experiences was asking, is it good?” In this episode, we cover some of the key issues such a question has raised for Mike - like celebrity culture and toxic masculinity - as well as what it’s like to do the work of insider critique in such a public role. Show Notes Resources: The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill Mike’s books Similar NSE episodes: Nancy French: Ghosted by Her Own Tribe Katelyn Beaty: How Celebrity Culture is Hurting the Church Kristin Du Mez: Jesus and John Wayne PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript of Abridged Episode Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

How do you raise criticisms about a group of which you consider yourself to be a member? Mike Cosper hosted The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill, a podcast critiquing a lot of the tendencies of American Christianity. “ People are looking at Christianity and saying, is it true?” he says. “I think where I landed after my own negative experiences was asking, is it good?” In this episode, we cover some of the key issues such a question has raised for Mike - like celebrity culture and toxic masculinity - as well as what it’s like to do the work of insider critique in such a public role. Show Notes Resources: The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill Mike’s books Similar NSE episodes: Nancy French: Ghosted by Her Own Tribe Katelyn Beaty: How Celebrity Culture is Hurting the Church Kristin Du Mez: Jesus and John Wayne PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Rainn Wilson. Bears, beets, Battlestar Galactica… and spirituality? In a time of cultural division and political polarization, what role can spirituality play in healing our fractured world? Rainn Wilson—best known as Dwight Schrute from The Office—isn't just a comedy icon. He’s also become an unlikely voice for spiritual reflection in Hollywood, where such conversations are often taboo. In this candid and thought-provoking interview, Wilson opens up about why he believes our divided world desperately needs a renewed spiritual vocabulary—and what that might look like beyond traditional religion. Show Notes Resources: “Soul Boom” by Rainn Wilson Laughing Matters Documentary Similar NSE episodes: Actor and Activist: Martin Sheen The Road to Character: David Brooks PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript of Abridged Episode Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

Bears, beets, Battlestar Galactica… and spirituality? In a time of cultural division and political polarization, what role can spirituality play in healing our fractured world? Rainn Wilson—best known as Dwight Schrute from The Office—isn't just a comedy icon. He’s also become an unlikely voice for spiritual reflection in Hollywood, where such conversations are often taboo. In this candid and thought-provoking interview, Wilson opens up about why he believes our divided world desperately needs a renewed spiritual vocabulary—and what that might look like beyond traditional religion. Show Notes Resources: “Soul Boom” by Rainn Wilson Laughing Matters Documentary Similar NSE episodes: Actor and Activist: Martin Sheen The Road to Character: David Brooks PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Marisa Franco. How important is it to have friends? Loneliness has reached epidemic levels in many countries, with research suggesting that it’s harder than ever for us to make and keep friends. And according to Marisa Franco, the issue isn’t trivial. “ Loneliness is as toxic for our bodies as smoking 15 cigarettes a day,” she says. “We are fundamentally social creatures… it's okay that you really want friends.” In this episode, she explains why friendship is a crucial aspect of a flourishing life, and gives helpful advice for those looking to make and keep friends. Show Notes Resources: “Platonic” by Marisa Franco The US Surgeon General’s Advisory on the Healing Effects of Social Connection and Community Similar NSE episodes: Alexandra Solomon: How to Have Flourishing Relationships Kristin Neff: The Power of Self-Compassion Robert Waldinger and Marc Schulz: The Good Life - Lessons from the World’s Longest Study on Happiness Kelly Corrigan: How Vulnerability Leads to Connection PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to pro… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

How important is it to have friends? Loneliness has reached epidemic levels in many countries, with research suggesting that it’s harder than ever for us to make and keep friends. And according to Marisa Franco, the issue isn’t trivial. “ Loneliness is as toxic for our bodies as smoking 15 cigarettes a day,” she says. “We are fundamentally social creatures… it's okay that you really want friends.” In this episode, she explains why friendship is a crucial aspect of a flourishing life, and gives helpful advice for those looking to make and keep friends. Show Notes Resources: “Platonic” by Marisa Franco The US Surgeon General’s Advisory on the Healing Effects of Social Connection and Community Similar NSE episodes: Alexandra Solomon: How to Have Flourishing Relationships Kristin Neff: The Power of Self-Compassion Robert Waldinger and Marc Schulz: The Good Life - Lessons from the World’s Longest Study on Happiness Kelly Corrigan: How Vulnerability Leads to Connection PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising a… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Drew Holcomb. ”The scarcity of life is what gives it value,” says singer-songwriter Drew Holcomb. “If we all lived forever, there would be no sort of rush to love and rush to justice and rush to mercy and rush to know people.” Drew’s new album, Memory Bank, co-created with his wife Ellie, is full of personal stories of love, resilience, mortality, and a strong but subtle social conscience. It was his father that inspired the title track on the album saying on their frequent family road trips that “ hope you guys don't expect to inherit anything. I put all my money in the memory bank.” Drew reflects on the impact this perspective has had on him, his art, and his faith. Drew and Lee also share their excitement about going on tour together this spring, along with Malcolm Gladwell, for No Small Endeavor: Live. Show Notes Resources: Drew’s website "The Last Sweet Mile" by Allen Levi Similar NSE episodes: Drew Holcomb: Fighting Dragons and Singing at Loss Russ Taff: Music, Addiction, and Redemption Clay Hobbs: The Wisdom of Numbering Your Days PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

”The scarcity of life is what gives it value,” says singer-songwriter Drew Holcomb. “If we all lived forever, there would be no sort of rush to love and rush to justice and rush to mercy and rush to know people.” Drew’s new album, Memory Bank, co-created with his wife Ellie, is full of personal stories of love, resilience, mortality, and a strong but subtle social conscience. It was his father that inspired the title track on the album saying on their frequent family road trips that “ hope you guys don't expect to inherit anything. I put all my money in the memory bank.” Drew reflects on the impact this perspective has had on him, his art, and his faith. Drew and Lee also share their excitement about going on tour together this spring, along with Malcolm Gladwell, for No Small Endeavor: Live. Show Notes Resources: Drew’s website "The Last Sweet Mile" by Allen Levi Similar NSE episodes: Drew Holcomb: Fighting Dragons and Singing at Loss Russ Taff: Music, Addiction, and Redemption Clay Hobbs: The Wisdom of Numbering Your Days PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazo… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Jacques Pépin. “Food is the great equalizer.” This is the mantra that has fueled the career of Jacques Pépin, who is respected as one of the finest chefs in the world. It has led him to cook for presidents and in world-class restaurants, and inspired him to write over thirty books. In this episode, he explains the role food plays in a flourishing life, describing how it breaks down barriers, builds community, and recalls us to ourselves, all while describing his own journey from a small French village to international culinary fame. Show Notes Resources: Jacques’s website “The French Chef” SNL sketch “La Technique” by Jacques Pépin Similar NSE episodes: Ben Cohen: Peace, Justice, Ice Cream Malcolm Gladwell: Becoming Malcolm Peter Harris and Jo Swinney: A Place at the Table PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript of Abridged Episode Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

“Food is the great equalizer.” This is the mantra that has fueled the career of Jacques Pépin, who is respected as one of the finest chefs in the world. It has led him to cook for presidents and in world-class restaurants, and inspired him to write over thirty books. In this episode, he explains the role food plays in a flourishing life, describing how it breaks down barriers, builds community, and recalls us to ourselves, all while describing his own journey from a small French village to international culinary fame. Show Notes Resources: Jacques’s website “The French Chef” SNL sketch “La Technique” by Jacques Pépin Similar NSE episodes: Ben Cohen: Peace, Justice, Ice Cream Malcolm Gladwell: Becoming Malcolm Peter Harris and Jo Swinney: A Place at the Table PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Francis Collins. Francis Collins has led some of the most significant scientific initiatives of our time, including the Human Genome Project and the National Institutes of Health under three U.S. presidents. In his new book, The Road to Wisdom, Collins grapples with the erosion of public trust in science, the polarization of society, and the challenge of discerning truth in the modern age. In this conversation, Collins shares insights from his experiences during the COVID-19 pandemic, his journey from atheism to Christian faith, and the importance of humility in the pursuit of knowledge. He reflects on his unlikely friendship with the late atheist Christopher Hitchens, the philosophical roots of truth skepticism, and the need for genuine dialogue across divides. Join us as we explore how wisdom, truth, science, and faith intersect—and why curiosity and compassion might just be the antidote to our age of distrust. Show Notes Resources: "The Road to Wisdom" by Francis Collins Similar NSE episodes: Quincy Byrdsong: Tuskegee, Healthcare, Justice Jennifer Wiseman: How Science Produces Wonder David Wilkinson: The (Not Really) War Between Science and Faith Rachel Held Evans, Francis Collins, and Ed Larson: Faith, Science, Humility PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript of Abridged Episode Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn adverti… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

Francis Collins has led some of the most significant scientific initiatives of our time, including the Human Genome Project and the National Institutes of Health under three U.S. presidents. In his new book, The Road to Wisdom, Collins grapples with the erosion of public trust in science, the polarization of society, and the challenge of discerning truth in the modern age. In this conversation, Collins shares insights from his experiences during the COVID-19 pandemic, his journey from atheism to Christian faith, and the importance of humility in the pursuit of knowledge. He reflects on his unlikely friendship with the late atheist Christopher Hitchens, the philosophical roots of truth skepticism, and the need for genuine dialogue across divides. Join us as we explore how wisdom, truth, science, and faith intersect—and why curiosity and compassion might just be the antidote to our age of distrust. Show Notes Resources: "The Road to Wisdom" by Francis Collins Similar NSE episodes: Quincy Byrdsong: Tuskegee, Healthcare, Justice Jennifer Wiseman: How Science Produces Wonder David Wilkinson: The (Not Really) War Between Science and Faith Rachel Held Evans, Francis Collins, and Ed Larson: Faith, Science, Humility PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Great Feeling Studios, the team behind No Small Endeavor and other award-winning podcasts, helps nonprofits and brands tell stories that inspire action. If your organization has a message that deserves to be heard, start your podcast at helpmemakeapodcast.com. Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sit… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Nancy French. Nancy French has spent her career helping others tell their stories. As a five-time New York Times bestselling ghostwriter, she has worked with prominent conservatives, celebrities, and political figures. But in her new memoir, Ghosted: An American Story, Nancy turns the pen on herself, recounting her own journey through faith, politics, and personal betrayal. A lifelong conservative, Nancy never expected that standing against Donald Trump would lead to ostracism from her own community. Nor did she foresee how uncovering systemic abuse at a major Christian camp would result in personal vitriol toward her. In this deeply honest conversation, Nancy and Lee discuss the personal cost of truth-telling, the cultural divide in America, and how faith can persist even amid profound disappointment. Show Notes Resources: Ghosted: An American Story by Nancy French David French’s NYT column USA Today article: Kanakuk Abuse Investigation Gretchen Carlson’s work on NDAs, workplace harassment No More SAMHSA Similar NSE episodes: David French & Russell Moore: How Should Christians Do Politics Taking the Beatitudes Seriously: John Dear Kristin Du Mez sits with David French PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to prov… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

Nancy French has spent her career helping others tell their stories. As a five-time New York Times bestselling ghostwriter, she has worked with prominent conservatives, celebrities, and political figures. But in her new memoir, Ghosted: An American Story, Nancy turns the pen on herself, recounting her own journey through faith, politics, and personal betrayal. A lifelong conservative, Nancy never expected that standing against Donald Trump would lead to ostracization from her own community. Nor did she foresee how uncovering systemic abuse at a major Christian camp would result in personal vitriol toward her. In this deeply honest conversation, Nancy and Lee discuss the personal cost of truth-telling, the cultural divide in America, and how faith can persist even amid profound disappointment. Show Notes Resources mentioned this episode: Ghosted: An American Story by Nancy French David French’s NYT column USA Today article: Kanakuk Abuse Investigation Gretchen Carlson’s work on NDAs, workplace harassment No More SAMHSA Similar NSE episodes: David French & Russell Moore: How Should Christians Do Politics Taking the Beatitudes Seriously: John Dear Kristin Du Mez sits with David French PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advert… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Mpho Tutu van Furth. What does it mean to ask someone for forgiveness? The experience after Apartheid in South Africa has much to teach us. “In English, you say, ‘I’m sorry, forgive me.’ It’s all about me” Says Mpho Tutu van Furth, daughter to the late Desmond Tutu. But in the South African language of Xhosa “You say ndicela uxolo which means ‘I ask for peace’. And that’s a very different thing than ‘forgive me’” In this episode, explore the deep impact of apartheid in South Africa, the meaning of true forgiveness, and the profound philosophy of Ubuntu. Discover how Mpho carries on her father's legacy of peace and reconciliation while navigating her own journey as an Episcopalian priest and social activist. This heartfelt and enlightening conversation delves into the courage required to love, forgive, and build a just community. Show Notes Resources mentioned this episode: The Desmond & Leah Tutu Legacy Foundation Forgiveness and Reparation: The Healing Journey by Mpho Tutu The Book of Forgiving by Desdmond Tutu and Mpho Tutu Truth and Reconciliation Commission of South Africa Similar NSE episodes: Azim Khamisa: Ending Violence Through Forgiveness Forgiving My Mother’s Murderer: Sharon Risher Pádraig Ó Tuama: A Poet’s Work in Peace and Reconciliation PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript of Abridged Episode Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

What does it mean to ask someone for forgiveness? The experience after Apartheid in South Africa has much to teach us. “In English, you say, ‘I’m sorry, forgive me.’ It’s all about me” Says Mpho Tutu van Furth, the daughter to the late Desmond Tutu. But in the South African language of Xhosa “You say ndicela uxolo which means ‘I ask for peace’. And that’s a very different thing than ‘forgive me’” In this episode, explore the deep impact of apartheid in South Africa, the meaning of true forgiveness, and the profound philosophy of Ubuntu. Discover how Mpho carries on her father's legacy of peace and reconciliation while navigating her own journey as an Episcopalian priest and social activist. This heartfelt and enlightening conversation delves into the courage required to love, forgive, and build a just community. Show Notes Resources mentioned this episode: The Desmond & Leah Tutu Legacy Foundation Forgiveness and Reparation: The Healing Journey by Mpho Tutu The Book of Forgiving by Desdmond Tutu and Mpho Tutu Truth and Reconciliation Commission of South Africa Similar NSE episodes: Azim Khamisa: Ending Violence Through Forgiveness Forgiving My Mother’s Murderer: Sharon Risher Pádraig Ó Tuama: A Poet’s Work in Peace and Reconciliation PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linki… Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Russ Taff. “I was 24 when I won my first Grammy,” says Russ Taff. “And within an hour, all the joy is gone.” Russ is a legend in Gospel music circles. His accolades include six Grammys, sixteen Doves, and three inductions into the GMA Hall of Fame for his work as a solo artist and a member of multiple bands. But underneath—his career, his success, and his past, almost broke him. In this episode, Russ gets vulnerable about his childhood trauma, his self-hatred, his alcoholism, and his long road to recovery and forgiveness. Show Notes Resources mentioned this episode: Russ’s Website "Cover Story" by Russ Taff Similar NSE episodes: Amy Grant: Fame, Vulnerability, and Staying Grounded Drew Holcomb: Fighting Dragons and Singing at Loss Megan Barry: Addiction, Loss, Possibility Ashley Cleveland: Does This Make My Butt Look Big? PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript of Abridged Episode Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

“I was 24 when I won my first Grammy,” says Russ Taff. “And within an hour, all the joy is gone.” Russ is a legend in Gospel music circles. His accolades include six Grammys, sixteen Doves, and three inductions into the GMA Hall of Fame for his work as a solo artist and a member of multiple bands. But underneath—his career, his success, and his past, almost broke him. In this episode, Russ gets vulnerable about his childhood trauma, his self-hatred, his alcoholism, and his long road to recovery and forgiveness. Show Notes Resources mentioned this episode: Russ’s Website "Cover Story" by Russ Taff Similar NSE episodes: Amy Grant: Fame, Vulnerability, and Staying Grounded Drew Holcomb: Fighting Dragons and Singing at Loss Megan Barry: Addiction, Loss, Possibility Ashley Cleveland: Does This Make My Butt Look Big? PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcription Link Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

This is our unabridged interview with Alexandra Solomon. Is your love life in need of a tune-up? Just in time for Valentine's Day, renowned relationship expert Dr. Alexandra Solomon joins us to share powerful insights from her book, "Loving Bravely." Discover how self-awareness and understanding your past can dramatically improve your present relationships. Dr. Solomon unpacks the secrets to thriving intimacy, from mastering the art of apology to staying truly present with your partner. Plus, get practical tools for navigating the inevitable challenges of long-term love. Tune in for this insightful conversation that will empower you to build stronger, more fulfilling relationships. Show Notes Resources mentioned this episode: Reimagining Love Podcast “Loving Bravely” by Alexandra Solomon Similar NSE episodes: Kristin Neff: The Power of Self-Compassion Heather Holleman: The Art of Conversation Robert Waldinger and Marc Schulz: Lessons from the World’s Longest Scientific Study of Happiness PDF of Lee's Interview Notes Transcript of Abridged Interview Want more NSE? JOIN NSE+ Today! Our subscriber only community with bonus episodes designed specifically to help you live a good life, ad-free listening, and discounts on live shows Subscribe to episodes: Apple | Spotify | Amazon | Google | YouTube Follow Us: Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | YouTube Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com See Privacy Policy: Privacy Policy Amazon Affiliate Disclosure: Tokens Media, LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices